Confidence, Purpose & Imposter Syndrome w/ Kate Baker Demers | Power Theory 007

What I want people to realize is that actually leading and going on this adventure, whatever it is, is actually a blast. I mean, I do this work because I'm kind of a social justice warrior, right? Like, I want justice for kids that are being abused. We don't have enough leaders, right? We don't have enough young people that are getting into leadership. Problem is that most people, they don't believe it themselves. They don't feel like they have the agency to do it, or they don't feel like they're worthy of it or they feel too young. You don't have to be all things to all people. Right? Okay. I mean, I deal with this all the time. I'm gonna be general manager of this company, and I don't have a college degree, and I'm petrified why. But you're 50 years old. Who the heck cares about your college degree? When something scares you, it's probably the right thing to do. That means you're pushing yourself. If I thought about the size of this little thing that I run, it terrifies me. Like, you do have the agency. Okay? I know one that I'm there to be in service to others. And so with that mindset, you can sit anywhere. Welcome back to power theory. My name is Russ Willette. I'm an executive coach. My purpose is to help people find their personal agency in power. Today we're going to talk with Kate Baker Demers, who's the executive director of the children's Scholarship fund here in New Hampshire. And we're also going to cover personal power. She's going to talk to us about her leadership philosophy, how to create strong development teams and development mindsets, which also kind of shifts a little bit into sales as well. She's just a fantastic person to work with. I serve with her on a board, and her energy is first. When I met her, I thought. I didn't think fruitcake, but I thought. I thought fair Russ fun. I thought, wow, this is going to be upsetting. To the apple cart. Center of the apple cart. Cape edge, Mers. Total, just wisdom and just wisdom and intelligence and energy and just freshness and just pure professionalism. And it's so. It's been great. So, you know, she's inspired me, and we're gonna hear a little bit from her today. So thank you. Thanks for having me. Yeah. Thank you very much to be here. Kate is the executive director of Children's Scholarship Fund, which is a national organization. Right. And you're running the New Hampshire branch of that? That's right, yeah. You've got it. And how long you been doing that? So I'm going on about, what is that, eleven years? Yeah. So tell us. You tell us. Tell us your story. Tell us your bio. I can't believe it myself. So my children scholarship fund in New Hampshire gives scholarships to kids that are low and moderate income in k twelve. And so you might not otherwise think this is something that's needed. But imagine you're in a school and you're being bullied and your family, here's an example of one of our families parents. Your dad's the truck driver that puts the Coca Cola in the coolers in the convenience stores, right? I mean, that's a good job. You can survive on that job. But if you have a bullied kid, you can't afford private school. Okay? So you need a scholarship from us to be able to switch the school for your child. And so we're doing that all over the state of New Hampshire. You're right. Children's Scholarship fund is a national, we're part, our New Hampshire program is part of the national program. Everything we do and raise in New Hampshire stays in New Hampshire. We're kind of like in a bubble over here. But we run two programs. One's a scholarship program, another one's called Education Freedom accounts. And yeah, I've been doing that for about eleven years. And I got there really kind of because my own kids, you know, when they were young, I realized that they needed different kinds of education options. And I spent with one of my kids so long kind of advocating and fighting with the school that I realized, wait a minute, I could probably even start my own school in this period of time that I was spending so much time advocating. And so I at that time had kind of a group of parents in Manchester. We had this little kind of parent support group. That group went on to start a school and that school became a charter school that still exists today. So that was cool. But I sat on the board of that charter school for three years and I don't know how much you know about charter schools, but their entrance is by lottery. Okay, so the school only holds about 100 kids, right? You know, we'd have like, you know, 20 available seats and 100 kids would apply for the 20 seats and then we would use these like merciless bingo balls to give away the seats. And so 20, you know, kids would get them and then the other hundred kids would cry because they didn't get into the school that would be the right fit for them. And I thought to myself, after watching this year after year, who's helping the rest of these kids? Cause I knew there was seats available in schools all over the state, right? I mean, I lived in Manchester, so I knew there was little catholic school, Montessori school. I knew you could go out to the Waldorf school in Wilton. I just knew these families didn't have money. Right. And money is a problem you can solve for us. Right. And so at the same time, my friend was in the New Hampshire legislature, which, for people listening outside of New Hampshire, should realize that's not that exciting and original. You know, there's 424 legislators. Like, you could trip over them if you walk down the street. Okay. So knowing someone in the legislature is not that fancy, but he showed me this education tax credit bill, and I, in my craziness. So you study? Yeah. I said, listen, if you can get that passed, I'll quit my job and start the scholarship fund, because I knew families needed it and I thought it would, you know. You know, you say things, Russ, and you don't really think about the implications. Right. You don't think ahead. Like. Yeah, but the lesson here is that you followed something that was totally passionate to you. Totally. I turned, like, my hobby into my job. Yeah. And I liked it. And I did. When I read the website, I saw that I did notice that you can make $100,000 a year if the circumstances are there, that you can get. You can get help. Like, I remember when my wife and I were. It's low and moderate income families. When we were starting out and we had little, little kids, there's no. No way we could think about affording. That's right. To send a private school like we. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. So anyways, that's. That's great you do that. It's so fun. I mean, it's been such a wild, wild adventure, you know? So I want to get into. I got some specific questions about development stuff. Okay. But how does. It's like, I have several friends. So you're an executive director of a nonprofit? Yes. A big part of the job is development and raising funds and finding that money and so on. And I know a lot. Well, it's an emergency. I mean, think about it. I have to raise the money because we give it away every year. Okay. So I raise the money the year before and then give it all away the next year. That's the way this program works. And so it's an emergency, actually, because now there's 1000 kids relying on us to provide their scholarships. If we didn't raise the money. They wouldn't have the tuition to attend their school or continue attending. So, yes, fundraising for me is definitely an emergency because I've got to continually grow and add more kids. Cause there's so many kids to help. I mean, there's wait lists upon wait lists of children who need help. And then two. You're right. I have to raise that money. Re raise millions of dollars every year. Yes. Right. So. And I know lots of people that have moved from, like, banking into development or something. In development, I have a friend, great friend of mine, who's a consultant. Development, he just kills it. My job before this was, like, accounting and business management. Yeah, there's great clients, and he's doing really well. He was originally a banker, and he started an executive coach. And the executive coach worked with him and said, hey, listen, what do you like? And he said, well, I really like the social aspect of things and kind of moved him in. He got into a big nonprofit beside development. He grew his way up. But it's always fascinating to me how he did that. So, I mean, your journey came, you were doing, you worked at a corporation for a while. Looks like you did pr or accounting. Actually, I did accounting and business management in my pre job before this. And I did work at a school also. So I have some education and some business finance type background. This was my actually first fundraising job that I ever had. Wow. See that? Look at that. Right? Yes. I had not done really, besides, like, you know, like mommy fundraising, you know, like PTA, you know. Well, there's something I tell you. So I, like, I do serve on. I've served on boards. Yeah. I never have any problem asking for money. I have no problem. You could put me in front of somebody and I'll say, this is what we do, and this what we need to help with. And I actually enjoy it. Like, where did that come from? Right? Yeah, I remember the first experience I had is I was. I was. I was at Raytheon. I was buried in finance somewhere, and I just wanted to get involved in my community. And I had my first kid, and I thought, I want to be involved in the community somehow. And I looked at Kiwanis and I tried looking at certain things, and I somehow got involved in the Boy scouts, and they needed someone to raise money for boy Scout scholarships, for the summer camps. Perfect kids that didn't have any money. And the only requirement was that the parents had to write a letter saying they wanted the money. Well, these letters came pouring in, and, I mean, your heart breaks when you read these things. So then I had to go off and I went to all the law firms and accounting firms and all the firms in the city of Manchester, and I sent them a letter, and I went and I went and met with some of them, like a committee to talk to them. And I just remember there's nothing but total joy now if I have to go into a company, especially when I first started my business and have to sell my company, it feels different. It feels a little lucky. It feels like, it's like we have that used car salesman thing in our head, but when it's for charity, to me, it's like a no brainer. I'm asking him for money. Cause I'm doing a really good thing. Anyway, so how did you make this transition from the corporate. Now, I know you told me about the scholarship fund and all that, but how did you make the intellectual transition from accounting in sales to. I'm a real gear grinder, too. I'll tell you. Like, I'm not gonna change either. Oh, really? Like, I have to drag myself through the. I'm real bad at it. I like that. I. Kicking and screaming. It's because I didn't know. Okay. And when you don't know, isn't that beautiful? Yes. When you don't know, you just sometimes will try things that, you know, you're just trying to help. Okay? So I go into everything with just, like, how can I help the people around me? Okay? I'm really. That's. That's the only reason I'm here. I figure on the earth is to serve the people around me. And so I'm trying to find ways that I can be useful. Okay? And just help people. And so that's number one. Right? Is I. I was going into it with the real. The right mindset. I really was just trying to learn and help. Right? And then two, I think, first of all, initially, I didn't know even that I would need to go and kind of sell it as an idea. I thought I would. You know, I had, like, the convenience. Like, I thought I would build it and people would come. Okay? So I first had to figure that out even when I opened the thing. And people did start to donate a little bit, but it was teeny, teeny. It might have been 100,000 in that first year, which would just help a few kids. And so I didn't realize, one, I had to figure out that I had to go out there and talk to people and then tell them to donate. It even took me, like six months to figure that out, that I had to go out and tell people, hey, here's some kids you can help. Come on over here with me. Right. And then once I figured out, actually, that I needed to tell people about it and tell them that they could, you know, get on the team and help, then I had it. Right. And so for me, again, you asked, how do you, you know, that initial phase make that the emotional. It's understanding that I'm out there helping people to help kids and get on the team. Right, right. Okay. So it's not that I'm saying donate to a thing, although I do volunteer sometimes with the Rotary Club in Concord and ring the Salvation army bell. Okay. I am one of the. I would stand out there with a bucket and say, give me your. Give me your dollars. Right. But what I'm really doing is inviting people to participate in helping children in New Hampshire to be able to get the education and learning experiences that are right for them. Everybody wants to do that. That's really fun. It's awesome to know that your money is going to help kids in your community to be able to thrive. I mean, those are our future leaders. Those are my friends, future employees. Those are my mommy friends, future mommies, future dads. And so everybody loves that. And telling them that they can participate is fun and exciting, and so that's what it is. And once I realized that that was what I needed to do, I was able to actually start to do it. I, of course, had to realize that that's what it is. Yeah. But then. And so it's also something like, entrepreneurial about what you did. Like, so you. You had. You would burn the ships behind you. I mean, no, everybody loved me with the previous job, I'm sure. But, I mean, you've gone back to it. Yeah, but you still, like, in your mind, you're all in, and you weren't gonna go back. I almost starved, like, three times starting. And so when you're pressed against the wall like that, you kind of. You kind of say, you take, okay, I've got to try this. Yes. I started it as my own little, for example, 501 C three. And you mentioned at the beginning of the show that I'm part of children's scholarship fund national. That didn't happen until 2016, when I had almost starved to death three times at that point. And I needed more infrastructure. And you can't just build infrastructure in New Hampshire. It's a small state. Right. Our unemployment is zero. And so, you know. All right, so let me just. That's all part of it. So you bring. What you bring to the table is you bring this entrepreneurial spirit. You have this core business background. You've almost starved. You had to grind your way through change and change yourself. That's all really positive. So one of the missions here is that, you know, we don't. We don't have enough leaders, right. We don't have enough young people that are getting into leadership. We see more and more people just like saying, checking out and, you know, calling it in and not, you know. So one of the things I. What I want people to realize is that actually leading and going on this adventure, whatever it is, is actually a blast. Right. And extremely fulfilling. And what we find is, so let's say somebody starts, someone starts an ad agency or someone starts a. A coaching business or someone starts some kind of firm, a little accounting firm. We say to them, okay, what we want you to do is you need to go off and sell yourself. Now, it sounds different than development, but really it's like the psychology is the same. You have a service to offer. Do they have to pay their taxes? Are they going to get in trouble with the IR's? Can you help them? Yes. The problem is that most people can help them, but they don't believe it, or they don't believe it themselves, or they don't have the internal agency and they don't feel like they have the agency to do it, or they don't feel like they're worthy of it, or they feel too young. Right. Or they feel like they don't have the right education. I mean, I deal with this all the time. I'm running. I'm going to be general manager of this company and I don't have a college degree, and I'm petrified why. But you're 50 years old. Who the heck cares about your college degree? The problem is, is that the world does. You don't need to laugh at that. Have. Why is that an obstacle for you? Or a 30 year old who's trying to offer some kind of counseling service or something like that, and you say to her, well, go off and sell it. Call those people, ask for that work. Tell them you want them as a client. But how can I do that? Because I'm not worthy of it. Yes, you are worthy of it. I have an idea. There's an upside to that. When something scares you, it's probably the right thing to do. Right. Okay. When you're in this space, because that means you're pushing yourself. And so maybe what? The advice you should be giving to those growing people is good. That's the right way to feel. Now, what do we do with that? Right. Because when you're the goals. If I thought about the size of this little thing that I run, it terrifies me. Okay. Because there's so many kids relying on us to get their education. Like, it's terrifying. Right. And so I think when your goals or ideas or what you have to do next scares you a little bit. That's right. Right. And so it's. What do you do with that fear? Do you. Okay. Does your fear make you back down? Okay. Then you maybe should need to rethink. Right. And so that's. Instead of telling them they shouldn't be afraid, perhaps it's. What do they do with their fear now? Yeah. Right. Oh, I feel like I'm not good enough. Of course you feel like you're not good enough. Everyone feels like that. Yeah. Right. What do you do with it? Right. Okay, then go out. Everybody does feel that way. Yes. How it has to happen is they have to. They have to believe in themselves somehow. And it's easy just to say, believe in yourself. It's almost like, you know, just do it. Whether you believe. A degree in marketing. Yes. Do you have a degree? You know, did you go to, you know. Sure. Do you know how to take videos? Do you know how to do the. Yeah. You know all the stuff. Yeah. Well, I know all the algorithms. I got all this stuff figured out. Well, then why can't you sell it? Well, because, you know, who am I? Yeah. You know, I don't. And it's like, well, you're that person that knows all this stuff and the other person doesn't know this stuff. And what I find is that once they try it a few times and they realize, wow, I actually know more about this stuff than other people do. It's like getting them over that. So in your shop, do you have people helping you with development? I do, yeah. And so what is the. I mean, maybe it's break it into steps, too. Right. Because if, you know, you have. You have an end goal. I need to get here. Right. And I'm afraid. I know I'm afraid, and I know I'm not good enough, which is just normal human behavior. Right. And I know that I feel like I can't do all these pieces. Right. You can break that all into little bits and then just tackle one little bit at a time. Right. So, okay, let's just tackle the. I don't feel like I'm good enough and get a few more tools in my toolbox so that I'm like, okay, well, I'm still not good enough, but at least I have the tools. You know, I'm not going to try and turn that screw with a hammer. I'm going to get a screwdriver, right? So just get the tools that I need so that at least I can cover, cover it. And then, you know, fear is emotional. So take the time to just calm down and try and push the fear back so that you can at least just, you know, get past it. And then the last piece is just, you know, kind of do the things anyway because you know that if something scares you a little bit in this environment, then you're probably taking the right steps. And so, yes, I have someone who does this work with me, and she does the work in development totally different than I do, okay. Because she's a different kind of person than I am. Right. I wouldn't coach her even to do development the way that I do smart, okay. Because I do. Again, remember, I'm asking people to get on the team and get involved in the cause. And that's really the way I do everything is like this interpersonal, one on one. My co worker that also does this work with me actually is a published author. And so she's a writer. And so that's how, that's her preferred communication technique is doing things in writing instead of, you know, as you can, you could take me and kind of put me on a, you know, like a little marionette and just, you know, so she's not like that. And so she uses her strengths that she knows is her, you know, her wheelhouse. And so to your point earlier when you said, you know, how do you do this? Right. How do you, do, you know, sales or fundraising or development? The important thing is doing it the way that it's comfortable for you. And so maybe for some of the people that you're coaching who are saying, I don't know how to get there, again, break it into little pieces so that it's, you know, bite sized pieces that they can. Yeah. So my challenge is have them do it the way they, they feel comfortable. Find a way to feel comfortable. The challenge that I run into is that when they, by the time they get to me, they know what. They know what they're doing. Okay. They. Okay. They, yeah, they actually had some success. Okay. The problem is that they just because we have success, they don't believe in themselves. Like, they don't accept. So I got a call from. This is a very. It is an international company. Yeah. This woman calls me and says, like, you know, I need an executive coach. Okay? I just get promoted to president of this division. Congratulations. Congratulations. Good luck. So I go to her office, and she is, like, polished, okay? And she's like. She's got executive presence. I love her. And she's like, you know, very, very smart. And she's like, you know, put together in a way that looks, like, powerful. Yeah. And I sit in her big office, and she's like, I'm terrified. I'm a. I'm a fraud. Right? I'm a fraud. Like, how the hell did I get here? They're gonna find out. How do I. Maybe that's the trick. And then it's like, how do I know everything that's going on in the company all the time? I'm like, well, it doesn't work that way. Right. And the thing is, is that it's almost like. And I share this story because I want people. People know. It's like, at the highest levels, people, whenever there's a challenge, whoever you are, you're a human being that's gonna have, like, these, you know, this thing. So I said, well, how did you get here now? Like, what did you do to get here now? She goes, well, I just worked really hard, and I had. She worked in sales, which I find a lot of people have had a stent in sales, you know, to some extent, I worked in sales. I, you know, I know all the numbers, you know, and, you know, she's obviously got to be good with people. Right? So she's got all. I said, so what's different between this job and the next job? And, well, I got to deal with this corporate stuff now, and, like, it was all these other anxieties. It's not that people don't know technically what to do. Right. It's like they just. It's like they. They have to. It's the point of getting over that. Fear. Yes. Of recognizing. Well, I'm afraid now, yes. And not, holy shit, but I'm afraid now, yes. Isn't this freaking great? Like, wow. Like, how do we. Like, okay. I'm not ever. And I know I can get through this because I've done this before. Right? So let's say you get promoted to run philanthropy for the state of New Hampshire. Some big job or something like that. The first call is going to be, holy shit. Like, how did. I don't deserve this? I only ran a couple of nonprofits before. I'm not going to be able to do that. And yet we still have to get, you know, you have to kind of dig in and get over that. Yeah. So the challenge is you want to get someone in sales or you want to get someone, you know, you're working for a company and they say to you, we need you to sell some product. You're an engineer. I want you to sell product. Yeah, but I don't know how to sell product. Well, you still need to. That's what's gonna be part of the job now. You're a sales engineer. You gotta go with the sales guy. Right. And they, and they get all freaked out about it. It's like, just, just go and make friends. Just go in there, do the right thing. That's the right. But they don't feel like they have the capacity or the, or the, or the agency to be able to do it like you do have the agency. Yeah. And people. And the mystery is that because I don't know what everybody else knows. Everything else. Right. Yeah. So you and I sit on the board together. Right? Remember the first time you went to the board? Maybe it's different for you, but for me, the first time I went to those boards, it's a good board. The first time I get on a board and the first time I go to a board meeting, I'm kind of petrified. I'm afraid to open my mouth. I'm not sure what to say. Maybe, maybe not you, but you know what I mean? You feel that, like, how do I fit in? Do I belong here? You know, how do you know, to your point, you just made a point that, again, you should add for your listeners who are trying to figure out how to overcome these things. Right. That you don't have to be all things to all people. Right. Okay. And so when somebody says to you, I'm afraid to do x, you know, fundraising, sales, whatever, just tell them to try to do a piece of it. Right. Right. Like, when you're in the meeting, just because you're in the board doesn't mean you have to talk. Right, right. Okay. So for, to your, to your example, the first time that you go to a board, that's a high functioning, high level, high stakes board that you're on now. Big responsibility. Right. It's okay to not talk. It's okay to just go in and say, I'm just gonna sit here and participate in a way that's comfortable for me today. Right. And so maybe that's the answer. Little bites, and then eventually you get more comfortable. And so maybe that's the answer to somebody beginning this type of. So I'm curious, do you get nervous when you sit on these big boards for the first time? I was. Not anymore. No. That's good. I think that, again, I understand my role. Okay. I know one, that I'm there to be in service to others. And so with that mindset, you can sit anywhere. Okay. I can sit in any room environment. Does it matter? Because I know I'm there to help in some way or not if they don't need my help. Right. And so when I'm in an environment like a board or any, any group, I know I'm there to serve. All right, so what I want to do. That's a comfortable question I want to ask for you when that shift happened for you, and I'm going to tell you when it happened for me. Okay. All right. So, okay, so, you know, I've been a little bit of an overachiever most of my life. Not the best, not the best grades, but work really hard. I always knew that if I worked really hard, and I found my. Always find myself in more challenging, challenging situations. And even when I started this business, I, you know, like, I had, you know, I had business experience. I worked in finance. I worked, you know, I had, you know, I worked in organizational development for a Fortune 500 company. You know, I had some great experiences. I went and got some certificates on how to perform some of this work. The tools in your toolbox. Tools by toolbox. But I still just felt, and I remember the last day of one of the trainings, I said, so now what do I do? Like, this isn't enough information. I remember being like, I'm not prepared enough yet. Never feeling enough prepared. And this, I think, was part of my personality. Like, I was just always trying to fit it, just trying to be better or always feeling like I'm three steps below. I always just didn't feel like I fit in. I was. Oh, but I was worthy of it. And I kept trying and trying and trying. And then I decided to get a doctorate degree, right? And I thought, okay, and for some. So education was the thing for me, filling it with education. I'm not saying this is for everybody, but for me, the more education I got, the more I was proving to myself that I'm not an idiot, you know, that I'm actually worthy. Okay, it's a false. It's a false thing. It's not necessarily true. I was worthy before the degree. But it's like, that's that's the mindset. And then when I got the doctorate degree, it's almost like I. It all went away. And it went away because I actually went to a therapist. And I said to the therapist, this is, like, really safe space here. Thank you. Thank you for letting me be on your podcast. You're welcome. So I went to a therapist because I couldn't write the dissertation. I could not write it. Like, I was paralyzed. I had all this information. I had, like, a year left to finish it. And if you don't finish it in a year, they. Yeah, you're not getting the penis. You don't get it. You're not getting the doctor. So I. You know, I went to the. I called. I went to a therapist, and she had one session with me, and, like, within five minutes, I figured it out. You self sabotage her. No, what it was, was I. She took me back to first grade. I was sitting in first grade. Catholic school. Okay. Where'd you go to catholic school? St. Theresa's in Methuen. I don't know if they're there anymore. I went to St. Marie's there. You on the west side? Yeah. Yeah. And sister Theresa called on me, and I couldn't answer the question, and I couldn't talk. I got paralyzed. I remember. I don't know if it was third grade or whatever it was. I just remember she brings me back to this moment, and she says, well, how do you feel? I say, I feel stupid. And then it's like a flood of. I don't want to feel stupid in front of these pompous ass PhD panel committee people that are going to tell me I'm not worthy of them. That's what it was. So I've always had this little insecurity complex about that stuff. As soon as I did that, it was gone. And it's almost like, I can walk. I'll walk in a room of mbas from Harvard. I actually worked with a medical company in Cambridge, or all phds. And you should see the past. I mean, there were the lawyers. I mean, they think they know. It was like. It was really. I can handle them. I can handle them all. No problem now. But it was because I decided that I could. It was because I made the switch in my head that you know what I am, who I am. If you don't like me, you don't have to like me. I can offer you gifts. These are the gifts I'm giving you. And I'm. So that's the switch that made for me. What was the switch for you. Or maybe you never had that. So, you know, my. I'll just. I've been talking about my dad for a minute. Yeah. Okay. Because he's a leader that I really admire. He passed away over the summer, just to put my shaky voice and point of reference for everyone. But my dad was a kind of person who was. He's very gregarious and was like kind of the life of the party person, but had this pure kind of spirit where in anywhere he was. He was a leader, but he never wanted to be a leader. So he was always kind of one of those leaders from behind. But so not only did I learn that from him, but he would teach me. Again, no judging books by its cover. And so some of the stuff that you've said here is judging the book by its cover. Right. Assuming that somebody from Harvard is going to be. Right. Okay. And so he said, again, every person, treat them just like an original. It doesn't matter if they're the CEO or, you know, the janitor or whoever it is, you're going to treat everyone with respect and on equal footing. And so that mindset helped me to be able to just. You were peers with everybody. Go anywhere and relax a little bit. I mean, sometimes that shoots me in the foot because, you know, I could be too relaxed. And sometimes I might say I did grow up on the west side of Manchester. Right. Sometimes I'll say something that might be not the right joke at the right time or something like that. Right. You make mistakes too. Right. And so understanding that making a mistake is okay is also part of this. But yes, understanding that when there's a person around you, they're just a regular human like everyone else, there's probably something you can learn from them. If you can get rid of that fear and sit and listen and pull it right. There's something you can learn from them for sure. And probably something they can learn from you, even if you feel like there's nothing you have to teach. That would be like saying that if I'm talking to someone who is not at my level, I'm not gonna learn. That's not true. Right. Right. I'm gonna learn something from every person that I meet. In some way, they might have an experience that's totally original that I haven't experienced. And so just, you know, being able to put myself in their shoes for a minute could be valuable and. Or, yes, there's someone like, we were talking about our friend earlier in Concord, Teresa. Yeah. And it could be somebody like Teresa who turns out to be a mentor to you. Right. And so being open to meeting people, even if they are intimidating to you, is kind of the trick. And understanding that they're just humans, that's respect. That's being respectful to them. By saying, you know, I'm gonna treat the janitor the same as the CEO. The CEO wants to be treated the same. Oh, by the way, they wouldn't be CEO unless they. That's right. Humility. That's right. That's right. And so I think I thank my dad for that because he taught me that in kind of his adorable. I think that's a fantastic message for people because, like, in my situation, I was always kind of chasing it a little bit. Okay. I always kind of like, I gotta be more worthy. I've got to be more worthy. I gotta try a little harder. And I think there's a lot of people in professional life that are like that, and they do persevere. Yeah. I've always had the mindset that whoever. I met the president of Mitsubishi once, and I had to psych myself up. Like, I remember going up the elevator. I psyched myself up to say, he's just, you know, he's just a human being, Russ. He's just a human being. He gets up in the morning and brushes his teeth just like you do. Like, you know. And the funny thing is, when the elevator door opens, the president of Mitsubishi standing there with his little business card in his hand, and he bows, you know, like how? Well, welcome. Welcome to my world. Right? But I think that message is good. If you just look at everybody as offering something, no matter what this station is, and I have something for them if they're open. How can I be of service to them? How can I be of service to them and how can I help them? And I'm just gonna go into the world and engage that way. And if they don't like it, they don't like what I say in a meeting, well, hopefully I'll win them over next time. If not, they just. They lost. Okay, this is great. You know, I always ask this question to everybody. Tell me about, you know, who. Who is your model as of a leader, either in history or in your life or someone that's up, you know? And I'd like to give you a couple, give me a couple examples. Who do you see as a great leader? Yeah. People that I think are great leaders. So I've got a few different types of things that I think are valuable. So I love guts. Okay? People that do things, for example, like, when I think about leaders in the history of, you know, I think of, like, a mother Teresa, right, who was kind of old, I mean, in her thirties, when she decided she was just giving everything out and going to work with people in the. I hate that word, slums. But that's what it was. Right? And so not even a young person, you know, usually when you're trying to figure out which way you're going, you're. You're like, you think you're gonna do that in your twenties? But she was in the middle of her thirties when she made a total change. And so to me, that's real leadership, like, really gutsy. And then also, you know, doing whatever it takes. Right. Giving up. Sometimes when you want to get somewhere, it's not what you do. It's what you're willing to give up to get there. Right. And so she was willing to give up everything to go and help those people. And so I think that's a really exemplary, you know, an example of that. You know, for me, servant leadership is the most, I think, the most valuable type of type. Well, describe servant leadership, because I don't know if people really understand. Okay. You don't think so? Okay. I'd love to talk about that a little bit. So save that for a second, but keep that Mother Teresa. Yeah. So what were. What is it about? So say more. Like, tell me. Tell me the values that she had. Yeah. So she had courage and the way she saw herself. Remember her quote about the pencil? Right. So she just saw herself as a tool, okay. For helping. And so I think that mindset is what can facilitate change. Honestly, in our world, if everyone saw themselves as a tool for doing good, that would change the way that our society functioned. And so that's being humble. Humility. Yeah. And you. And you can't create. You can't invent that. You can't be like, I'm going to be humble today. You know, naturally, for her, it was her whole state of being, understanding that she wanted to make a difference and being willing to put her entire person kind of aside for the doing. And so, to me, that's kind of what servant leadership is. It's the doing is more important than any comfort or person or, you know. And earlier in the podcast, we were talking about getting over fear. Yeah. I mean, that might be one tool to get over fear is it's not about you anyway. Right, right. And so if you. If you're thinking about yourself and saying, I'm having trouble getting over this hump and doing something. Why don't you just take yourself out of the equation entirely? It's not about you anyway, right? It's going to be about the people around you and their experience. You're. It's only about you and your own stinking head. So get out of your own head and just help the people around you. So I guess that that's kind of the piece that, in her, I really. I mean, I can't emulate a saint, of course. I'm just a regular human, but, you know. No, but you can, because she was just a ring. She was really behaved like. Like a really. It was total humanity. She's doing the work. Right. She's literally just doing the work every day. What's another. What's another example again, my friend Teresa. Yeah. So we know Teresa. Yeah. Teresa Rosenberg. Yeah. She. Well, she was recently, what? Citizen of the year, you know, from the. From the Concord chamber. Just a couple. So. And she. I don't know if she's still divine. Millimeter. Bernstein. Bernstein. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. And she's just, again, another person. She was president of. President of Unitil. Or was it fair point? Fairpoint, yeah. Yeah. For a while. Yeah. And she's just, again, another person who I would describe as humble, which. So the people that, I see them on a pedestal. I mean, these people, Teresa, you know, mother Terrell, we got two Teresas. Who'd have thought? Yeah, maybe there's a theme. Maybe there is a theme. I put them on a pedestal, but they would just drag themselves off the pedestal in a minute and, you know. But Teresa Rosenberger, what I like about her style is she's very direct, but in a way that you can always hear it. And so sometimes she gives me instructions, but I don't even realize that she's giving me instructions because it's so comfortable. The way she approaches things is so human. The way she talks to me is so, you know, she's just such a great communicator and such a great person that you feel like she's in it with you all the time. You feel like she's got your back. She's your friend. Yeah, she's got your back. She's in it with me. And so when she's giving me even sometimes. Don't do that. Do this, Kate. Still, I know that she's all in it with me. And so that's that kind of team mentality, right. In a leader when it's either you're building your team or you're trying to get people on the team that's development or sales or, you know, getting your team to be happy and effective and efficient, kind of that collaboration. And I think collaboration isn't quite enough of a word because I'm thinking of it more as a coach. Right? Yeah. Right. Like an expert level. Like, probably like what you do when you're coaching people. Right. And helping them. But I know that. I see, you know, Theresa, my other Teresa Rosenberger, like that. I mean, she's like an executive director. So I have a. So I have a great story about Teresa. Okay, great. A bunch of years ago, I wrote a. I did this piece. It was, like, the ten most influential leaders in New Hampshire at the time that I saw as influential leaders. And the whole vibe of these pieces were that they've overcome a great deal. Yeah, she has. And when I originally interviewed them, I didn't know what they overcame. Oh, wow. But my theory is, is that great leaders have always. If we go back in your history, we'll find something that's affected you. We all have that. There's a reason to help bullied kids. Okay. There's a reason to help bullied kids. Right? Yes. Right. Like, there's always this. There's always something that has affected us, that make us, you know, the way we are. Right. So that was my theory. There was only one person that told me they didn't know, and I won't. He had. He had. He was perfect the way he was. He had nothing, you know? Of course. Good luck to you. But. But Theresa's story was, and you probably know this, is that she was hit by a car on a bicycle, and she lost. She lost, like, she lost her thinking ability. She lost her physical ability, and she had to go. She had to learn, like, from scratch, Holly Gann, how to do that. And that was before she was the president of Fairpoint. I know, right. So the most. I mean, first of all, let's just take a minute. She's a genius. Yes. Right? Yes. Brilliant. Brilliant. She says. She's telling me. She says, you know, it's funny. When I was at divine Melamid, I would. I couldn't. I wanted to walk to work because I wanted the exercise, and I. So she would walk to work, and she was funny. Every. Every day, there'd always be someone from divine moment that would meet me. Imagine that. Like, walk me in. Like, isn't that a nice story? Yeah, they did that, like, for her. Right? Yeah. And so anyway, she tells that great story. And there was one advice I asked her. I had a client that was. I call him the. He just couldn't make a decision. Okay. He just couldn't tonight as much as I tried. Also, by the way. Yeah. And I said, theresa, I need you to meet with this guy. And, you know, this is the situation. It was kind of like a strategic legal situation, which I wanted her to look at. And she comes back to me and she said, yeah, russ, thanks very much, but he's a paralyzed executive, okay. And there's no way that we're gonna. I'm gonna be able to help him, but I think he should do this. This. But I love the frankness of it. It was like, it was. You can hear it from her ear. Yeah. And she was just. She's always been just really good. She's been helping me since 2012. Okay. Just. Is she on the board or. She's on my advisory board. And she was one of the first people that I got hooked up with. Somebody introduced me to her when I started the thing saying, you need to talk to Theresa. Yeah. And she helped me with some planning and she's been helping and volunteering, helping me. Children's scholarship fund. Right. For eleven years. Okay. And so you don't have to wonder, you know, people will be like, how'd you do that? I mean, I surround myself with geniuses like that and I listen to what they say. Right? So who else is there? Another one? So, yeah, I mean, my dad, my two theresas and my dad. I really loved the way my dad was a leader in any space that he was in by accident. Okay? He got called to it. Yes. He wasn't leading on purpose ever, but any environment that we were in, my dad just was the leader by mistake, you know, because he was in service to the people around him because he cared so much. You know, my dad would like, give you his shirt off his back and the last $20 in his pocket. Right. He was one of those people, for example, he was such a big tipper that we all need to go to restaurants, you need to double your tips because my dad is not with us anymore. Okay. There's probably servers in Manchester that are earning significantly less money because my dad is not around to like, quadruple tip. Right. Okay. So he was just totally. In any environment, he never wanted to be the leader. He wasn't interested in ever being in a position of power or even management. But it didn't matter in any group he was in because he was in service to the people around him. He naturally attracted. Yeah. I mean, it's the secret. The secret to this is that the people that are really successful in leading, it's intuitive to them. It's not like they're trying to do it. They're getting called to it. So, are you a big tipper? Yeah, too big. I get from my house. He tries to take the slips away from me because I'm so dangerous with the pen. This is the deal. The deal is that when you give those three examples, you just described your own leadership style. Fair enough. Yeah. That's like, you can trace everything you said back to your values. I mean, that makes me feel really humble. I can't compare to any of those people. Please don't put me on the same level as those people, because that's a really high bar. I mean, maybe in 20 years, just like you. You said maybe in 20 years, I could be at that. Well, yeah. Point. I'm still. I'm still. I still see myself as a learner. Yeah. It's coming, though. Yeah. Maybe I'll always be a learner. There's no doubt. That show that. Yeah. You get a lot of good work to do. I know. And I'll always be a learner anyway. Even when I feel like I've learned that you can't learn everything. I mean, we're just little pea brain humans, right? Actually, we probably have. If we could get more access to it, we probably could do better, but that's a whole other discussion. So let me ask you a little bit about development and philanthropy. I just call it fundraising because I love fundraising. Yeah. So I sometimes get involved in strategic planning for nonprofits, and I did a couple last year, and I, of course, been involved in my own boards, and the whole landscape of philanthropy has really changed, like, so much to the point where I'm getting. Like, I'm getting over. I find myself looking at a Facebook thing and saying, oh, maybe I'll get. No. Like, I don't even know these people. Like, I don't. Is this a scam? Like, how many. How much of the stuff's coming? I don't know. That there's real life, right? Yeah, I don't know. So. But. But it's almost like there are. There are social changes going on with giving young people approaching. Different noise. Noisy. Yeah, real noisy. How do you frame all that? Or how do you think about that? Or, you know, is that something that, you know, maybe you only have your channel of finding it, but, I mean, we do have. We do come up with. Okay. As an organization. Okay, we do write a plan. Yeah. A communications plan that includes all of the methods of communication. So I guess let's just go to number one. Okay. Different people have different flavors of. They like different things. Right. Like, some people are like me and you, and they could talk all day, and they want to talk all day, and some people don't want to talk to us at all. Right. And so as people who could talk all day, I try to be respectful to the people who, you know, don't want that. Right. So number one is, I think, communicating with people in the style of communication that they want is the most important. And there's your marketing. Okay. Yeah. Not communicating in the way that I think we should. Okay. So some people like to read email. Some people like to have something in writing. Some people want me to call them. Some people want. Okay. And so while it's. Maybe I couldn't do this if it was giant. Okay. Somebody's gonna be listening and say, okay, Kate, that's lovely and great that you can customize your communications for every person in your world, but you have a small organization that's possible. It won't be possible when it's big, but I think it probably still is possible when it's big, because maybe if you were getting an email and something and writing in a call, you would ignore the email, read the thing that came in writing, and take my call. Right. And so I guess I'm just making sure I communicate with people in the way they want to be communicated with, not the way I think I want to communicate with them. And I think that goes multi. Right. That permeates the entire culture of development for me, because there's some people you have to meet with in person. Right. Especially since that's my strength. I mean, I want to meet with people in person. There's some people that I wouldn't meet with. They don't want to meet with me in person. Right. And so it's what they want to do, not what I want to do. Right. So are you finding you're competing for more dollars, or you're finding that people don't tell me that. And our fundraising has been increasing. Let's hope it continues that way. Everyone listening will tell you how to donate at the end of the show. I mean, it's been increasing even though the noise is increasing. I think, too, I acknowledge the noise and the competition. Okay. So if you were someone, I was coming here to tell you to make a contribution, I would acknowledge that the world is busy and noisy, and I understand you have competing forces, and then I would share with you how you could get involved, and then let it be up to you. I did have someone tell me once that I was the most patient fundraiser they'd ever met, and I thought that was the biggest compliment I had ever received. So I guess so these changes or these environmental changes around communication and maybe even some changes in giving that people we've experienced, the economic changes that are going on, the political divisiveness and things that are going on, I think what you're saying is none of that matters. What matters is that you're reaching people, following a strategy, and just executing on that strategy well. And again, honoring them for their current. There's some years, so somebody will be a donor. They're going to donate year after year for the most part. Right. And then somebody will say, okay, this year I can't donate because of x. Right. I would never mean that meant our relationship ended. Right. I would respect that they were in an unusual financial situation or. Right. And so that mindset is what carries, I guess, carries everything forward, because if there's never any animosity, hanging around with me is fun. Most of the people that are donating are my friends now because of the relationships that we've built through this. And donating for them is fun. Right. And if they couldn't donate, they wouldn't feel guilt because they would know, I'm okay. I'm gonna just keep going and help more kids and get them, but come back when you can. You're still part of the team, even though you could give me your hundred bucks this year. Year or whatever. Right. And so I think that, you know, doing that keeps everything authentic and growing because it's joining the team. Yeah. It's not just a mechanism. Right. Right. Does that make sense? Or I'm joining a family, or you're part of some kind of a family. So you and I listen, maybe some of the same podcasts we talked about prior. Right. Like some of the. We like to get stimulated by some of these. Both fruitcakes. Yeah. I like the brain. I want my brain to go. So there's a lot of talk about effective altruism. Okay. Okay. Yeah. What's your take on that? I mean, I. I mean, it's hard. It's hard for me because that's my just regular mode of operation. Right. Yeah. And so it's hard for me to conceptualize anything else. Right. Because I, again, feel like I was put here to be of service to people. Right. And so I don't have any other way of thinking. Yeah. So I am. People would sometimes say an over. Maybe I'm an over giver. You know, it might. Maybe it's too much. Will you tip twice as much as you? Yeah, maybe. It's. I don't know, but I don't know what too much is. Right. Right. It's like, give till it hurts. I don't. Yeah. So I. So I have trouble reflecting on it from my own perspective because I'm so in it. Like, if I could do more, I would do more. Right. Okay. And I spend every day of my life doing charity work. If I could do more, I would. Yeah. And so I don't even know if I could talk about it without it being so personal to me. That's all. Yeah. It's just nice to hear. It's nice to hear people are spreading that word about, you know, giving and being effective about their giving and things like that. But, I mean, I do think that. Here's one example from my bookish background is I am transparent as a nonprofit, and I do think that when you're giving, that's what you should look for. Right. When you're going to. Your donations are really valuable, to your point. Right. You said there's a lot of competition in the world, and, yes, you should give till it hurts, but you should also give where you know what's happening. Exactly. Yeah. And where the nonprofit is totally transparent with you, and they report back to you exactly what they did with your money. And so that was another thing I learned from my dad. Okay. Just do what you say you're going to do every time. Right. And in our world, that makes you an exceptional person if you literally do so. Russ. I do what I say I'm going to to do every time. All right? And that's it. There's no exceptions. And that's a simple concept that I think sometimes we overlook. But make sure that if you're gonna donate, right, you're gonna support a charity that they're doing what they say they're gonna do every time, because that's the whole role of a charity in our community. Right. Is that. Yeah. So say more about giving till it hurts. I love that phrase. So, my take on that is if, you know, if I'm sitting at a. You know, like, one of these nonprofit fundraisers, and, you know, you get your paddle in your hand and they say, you know, yeah, who wants to give $100? I think, well, that doesn't hurt enough. Yeah. Yes. All right. So I say to myself, okay, $500. That'll. That'll. That'll. That's where I want to go, it's okay to budget. And then I'll get up there and I'll think, oh, no. Yeah, you know what? Or they actually go backwards, right? Yeah. So I'm thinking now 500 is my number and they're saying 1010 thousand, 5000, 1000. And I just can't control myself. I'm gonna give. Paddle goes up. Meanwhile, shall I. My wife has bought like all kinds of things already. Like, no, she's not smashing me. She's already, oh, she does, she's already done. My husband does it too. And then we leave and, you know, we actually feel so good. Yeah, it's like, and you know, what's what. So to me it's like I always think about like, all right, so we have this event coming up. How much do I want to donate? I'm going to do it. So what hurts? This number hurts. And then I go just a little bit more. So say more about that. I mean, first of all, and I'm just going to speak from my personal perspective because that's all I have on this. Right. I can't tell you what hurts for you or I can tell you what I do in my life that makes me a little nutty. Okay. In this regard. So, you know, this is something I would never reveal. So you might have to edit out. I'm teasing. So I only buy used clothing. Yeah. And instead of buying new, so just thrift stores and online like a rage. So then I give away the money that I would otherwise. Okay. So it's like you can make choices that are like that. Okay. So that's kind of a give till it hurts. That's really cool. Okay. I would rather give the money away to charities or, you know, the church or, you know, wherever than I would to buy stuff. So I will give up buying something even that I need. Yeah. So that I can give, donate right. That money instead. And so I guess that's what I mean when I say give to her. It's right again. You should never, you know, you've got to make sure you have enough for yourself. Of course. You know what I mean? Like I'm not in that situation. Clothing and shelter and so I sometimes have or see some of the families in our scholarship program donate back to us. You know, like they'll give 25 or that's, that's what they're doing. Okay. Because these are people who are low income or, you know, I am free reduced lunch level income people already. Okay, so that's the poorest of our poor people around us. And then they're donating 20 or $50. I mean, that's giving Tiller, because, you know, they're taking that. They're not buying something to do that. Right? Because otherwise, they're spending all their money on food, clothing, and shelter. So now instead of buying ham, they're buying bologna. Yeah. I'm not gonna give me that money. I'm not gonna put you on the spot and ask you what you think. Like, society's giving percentages or something like that. And there's probably numbers about that, but, I mean, people are extremely generous. There are some people that are extremely generous, but I think there's a lot of people that just check out completely of anything like that. Now, maybe. Let me just give you. Let me just tell you, I'm in a bubble, remember? My bias is, this is my bias, and I might be. I might be. I might be wrong. Okay, listen, I'll call you on the carpet. It's a bias. Okay? When my son was. When my son was a little boy scout, okay, he used to go around, sell popcorn, right? Yeah. And we lived in Bedford, and Bedford has, like, this, like, there's old parts of Bedford, and then there's, you know, the McMansion part of Bedford. Right there. Yeah. And so the first year, you know, my son and I went out to the local, you know, the old Bedford, the people with the families that have grew up there. And I'm not saying that they don't have money, but there was just like, this more. There was just more this. You know, they had modest homes and, you know, modest cars, and. And we killed it. We sold so much popcorn, and these people would buy popcorn, and they were happy to see us. And so on the next year, I just marked 50 for a wreath, by the way, one of those wreaths that cost $25. So there's an example. Yes. Continue. So the next year, I'm like, dad's smart. Dad, you know what? I'm gonna take you. We're gonna go to the McMansion. We're gonna go to the rich communities right on this part of town. We're gonna go. We're gonna go sell popcorn. And my son would walk up to building after building, and he'd come back with nothing. Now, they would either not answer the door, okay, maybe they weren't home, or they would answer the door and just say, I'm not interested. Or they would answer the door and say, come back tomorrow. It was like, well, they couldn't be bothered. So my son comes back to the car at one point, we were standing in front of this big McMansion. He comes back to the car and he goes, I'm sorry, dad. I'm not cute anymore. What happened between year one to year two? And it's almost like, maybe, I'm not saying they don't give money to other places or anything, but it was like, where is your sense of. I mean, I don't know. It's like. So my sense is that there are people that give, and it seems to be the people that maybe have a different mindset, have certain values and so on, and there's people that don't give. And, I mean, I don't know where I'm going with this, other than it's like, I can't imagine. Like, I know lots of friends that they don't participate in any community activities. I don't know what they do. They might be doing stuff that I don't see, so I can't make a judgment about it, but I don't know. Well, we know you're discriminating against people in McMansions, number one. Okay? So you need to work on that. That's gonna be your personal challenge. Takeaway from today is let's not discriminate against people in McMansions on cul de sacs. So I think that, again, judge a book by the COVID too. Don't do that. Don't judge a book by its cover. Just because somebody's in one of those neighborhoods doesn't mean that they're not the giver because they didn't come to the door. They live in that neighborhood. So two checks there to your balance. Okay, do you get my point, though? I do, and I think those. So now I'm going to take that away. Okay, so we've said don't discriminate against McMansion people, but perhaps it's that those are the people getting asked all the time, probably. And they already have things that there. Let's give them the benefit of the doubt. Perhaps they already have things that they are giving to, and so they're maybe not as inclined to do a door thing because they're already, you know, have their suite of people that they're giving to. And then two second point on this is development and fundraising is a matching game. Okay? So it's not just broad, you know, like, I'm trying to find people for whom this donating to my charity and the scholarship for kids is a good fit for them. It's not going to be a good fit for everyone, and that's okay. Right. There are people for whom education is their thing. They're passionate about. Right. If they're passionate about education and then add on top of it, they're passionate about kids in their community. Right. Remember, my program has a tax credit, so some people may probably pay certain types of taxes. It's a good fit for them. So they have to have the. These traits. And so it's okay if someone doesn't donate, if they don't have those traits. Right. That doesn't mean they're not supporting. Yeah, but I think my general point really was more like, I don't know if there's an untapped source of people that don't know how to do this or aren't invested in it or don't understand the value, the personal fulfillment and the value of it. I would just say that. That, yes, you're right again. Since we're not discriminating against those people in the McMansions, we would say they haven't had the right opportunity. Maybe not right, or the opportunity presented in a way that they could get engaged and have it be meaningful. But I'm wondering, what's the biggest societal problem like? I'm wondering if it's, like a selfishness problem. I don't know if it's so much a selfishness problem as it is probably a noise problem. Right? Because if you're, if you've got all this stuff bombarding you all the time, what do you do? Yeah, you would probably shut it out. Right. And so maybe they're not seeing. I might be getting more cynical as I get older, and I'm not sure. And again, I don't. All I know is that when I first started this business, and I, you know, I'm gonna help everybody. And then at some point, I realized, probably too easy. I can't help, though, to be more cynical than me. I'm like a golden retriever over here. Okay, so it's like, don't compare yourself to the golden retriever and say, oh, I'm more cynical than Kate. Shocking. What? Lucy, you're not cynical at all. I'm like a golden retriever for the most part, yes. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I think I'm more like a wired, head pointing Griffon. Okay. But having said that, I feel like I'm getting a little bit more like, I used to think I could help anybody, but not everybody's ready to be helped. That's okay. That's okay. That's not a reflection on you, though. No, no, not a reflection on me. It's just like, okay, well, I'm not gonna be able to solve that problem. That's fine. I think that. And I think that when I look at what goes on in popular culture and politics and everything else, I look at that and I say, it feels like there's just so much. There's just so much, like, negativity and hatefulness. Right. But you're taking tribalism, you're taking action, so you can flip that on its head. So as long as you're doing everything you can, then it's okay to see that. I mean, I do this work because I'm kind of a social justice warrior, right? Like, I want justice for kids that are being abused in environments where they need a different. Right. They're being bullied or they're under, you know, ten grade levels behind and need to catch up. Right. I mean, I'm doing this for justice. Right. And so it's okay to look at the world with a. That mindset of, I need to help and fix and do everything we can do. Just don't let that be your, you know, acknowledge that you don't give up on your can. Even if that's the case, don't buy into it. Yes. Everyone is doing everything they can. Right. And that's the ship we're all in. And it's. We're never gonna be. None of us are ever gonna be perfect. It's a world full of humans, okay? There's gonna be something that's not right at any given time. And if you let that not right thing drive you to a place where then you can't be participating, I mean, then that's when it's really bad. Right. And so I think just continually to. Yeah, I'm not saying that's gonna get me off track. Just means it just. It's like, I just. Yeah. And I. I just wish I could. Like, I wish we could change that somehow. And we do have a fairly materialistic culture. Right, in America, and so that probably is something that we all can work on. Yeah. Is lessening our impact and our desire to have the latest and greatest thing. I mean, yes. That's probably someone everyone in America can work on. Right. Is not trying to just have the latest and greatest. Although these microphones are really nice, by the way. So it's just, you know, sometimes you need. These aren't even the good ones. And sometimes you need something like this. Right. Like, if we were like, okay, well, let's go get some used microphones from savers. They probably wouldn't have the same. So sometimes you do need a thing. Yeah. To do a job, a tool, and that's valuable. But I do think there's a balance there where there's a lot of, you know. Yes. We know our culture is materialistic, and we could all do better with less impact, you know. Yeah. Less materialistic and also probably less self indulgent. Sure. Of course. And probably a little less selfish. Sure. Couldn't we? All right. Everyone has room to improve in that, because, again, we're in our own heads. Right. We only think about ourselves in our little heads. So if we could get. I like to say that we're all coping and start to some extent. How can you be of service to the people around you? Is kind of a good start, probably. So as I'm sitting here, I really get the sense that. So, first of all, when I called you, when I said fruitcake earlier. Yeah, I have a fruitcake. I meant that in a very, very affectionate way. Thank you. I appreciate it. Like my sister, who I want to hang out with, and you are. You attract people to you. It's obvious why. You know, I, you know, the stuff that you've done over there is absolutely fantastic. I love that. I didn't know that it was an entrepreneurial story. Like, you started from scratch. I know. It turned my hobby into my job. Yeah. I love that. And that's that, then. That journey, I think, is got such growth effect on people and confidence effect. Right. I love that. You didn't. You don't necessarily. You don't struggle in a way that most. That I think most. Most of my experience when I see people do is, like, trying to be better and trying to have people like them and try to be perfectionist. And also, you just kind of like, I'm just gonna go give my gifts and do the best I can. Do the best I can, which is. Okay, that's great. It's all. It's all really, really, you know, profound. But if you had to tell, like, you know, when you're mentoring younger women. Okay, well, you don't have to say women, of course. I'm not ready for it yet. Yeah. You know, why do you say that? See that? See, there you go. I still want a mentor. You can still have to. A mentor. In fact, you can have as many mentors as you want. You don't need to tell them. They don't even need to know that you're a mentor. But anyways, you should be mentoring other people if you're not. Okay. But, I mean, so put yourself in that, you know, I mean, what are you, like 25? Yeah. Yeah, no, I'm gonna be 50. See? What do you mean you're not ready to mentor? Of course you're ready to mentor. Right? So you're, when you're mentoring people, like, you know, if you had to, like, just summarize. Okay, yeah, summarize. Like, you know, what's the best advice to give them? I mean, other than the things we've spoken about, right? I mean, other than give yourself, be passionate about what it is, you know, do the right thing, tip well, all that stuff, right? Like, what is it? What does it come, you know, like, what comes to mind is giving someone profound advice that'll really help them find their power. I mean, simple, right? That. Do what you say you're going to do every time and just do the next right thing. I love that, the next right thing. Because, you know, in every situation you're in, you always have decisions to make. And decisions, you know, can be hard to make decisions, but it also can be easy, right? It can be obvious. And I think if you're always doing the next right thing, then you'll continue on the right path. Does that make sense? And I, and I hate to use t shirt slogans or whatever, but I mean, it's, it's very simple because, you know, like, having good ethics and then acting on that layered with authenticity is kind of the magic, I guess. Because if I'm doing what I say I'm going to do every time and I'm making the next right, I'm doing the next right thing and then I'm honest and transparent with you about that. Then we have a relationship, then I've built the, then there's a comfortable, honest relationship there. And that's the bedrock. The relationships with the people around you, whether it's your peer or it's your boss or it's whoever it is, that's the bedrock for getting everything done. Because with a relationship, then we have a team, then we can collaborate, then we can problem solve, then we can fundraise, then we can make a difference for kids in the world. We can improve our society. We can pick up trash in our neighborhood. If we have all of those bedrocks in place, we can make all of that positive change. Yeah. Awesome. Great. So truly, honestly, it's a pleasure to work with you on that board. I'm sure you're gonna do some great. You got plenty of great things. I love that it's not a planned journey. I love that it's like if journeys would suck if you knew everything that was gonna happen. Yeah. You know? Yeah, it's scary. Just get dropped off and figure out where you're gonna stay tonight. Yes. And it's okay to be afraid. Be afraid. You know what city you want to go to tomorrow? I'm comparing this to my last portuguese trip that I took. That was a little too scripted for me. Yeah, it was less enjoyable, which is, let's just get in the car and drive somewhere. And I think sometimes we try to script out life too much. Fair enough. And I think there is some value in how can I help the people around me. Help people do the right thing, respect people, be real. Thanks to my dad. Connect and be a big tipper. And be a big tipper. Yeah. All right, we'll end with that. Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Thanks for having me. Just tell. Tell people how they can help your organization. Sure. So again, children's Scholarship fund is the organization I direct in New Hampshire. And scholarships for kids in k to twelve, we have a website, it's CSF New Hampshire, written out. We accept donations year round for scholarships for kids in k to twelve. And for some people that pay certain taxes in New Hampshire, we also offer a tax credit so they can find that information on our website or get in touch with me. My email, phone number. I'm probably the easiest person to find in New Hampshire. If you put my name into Google, you'll see. And I'm easy to reach because I love to have people on the team getting together and helping kids in New Hampshire. Thanks again. Thanks for having me.See all